Sure it makes you feel better to think that most male models date other models or are gay but I'm here to tell you you're wrong.  I have been working for a prestigious male model agency for many years and can tell you that the majority of the straight ones (and there are many straight ones) go out with very average looking girls.

Haven't many, many attractive people been **some** sort of model at some point? The local Sears store circular, your friend's band poster, those topless shots in Juggs. My ex was in a spread for Bicycling magazine on bike messenger fashion. My husband was in some crazy ads from a Swiss luggage company, because they wanted an "authentic punk San Franciscan." Seems like if you wanted to claim to having been a model, there's a lot of leeway. So, by that standard, anyone you date can claim to have dated a model. Just sayin'. I count my photo spreads in "High Heels" "Close Shaves," and that one shot in Hustler.

On a related note, you'll probably get x amount of feedback from people saying that men are more obsessed with looks, women with personality. Might be something to that. I've only dated one really schlubby looking guy, and I was attracted to him because he was such a major pervert (did S&M performances, etc.) That was intriguing, and I was able to overlook the fact that he was 5'7" and shaped like a barrel. He was also a nightclub bouncer and could kick my ass, so there's that. But still, people always asked why the hell I was with someone who looked like him . . . (BTW, he's an ex not because he's short and chunky but because he's an asshole . . .)

All the really hot guys (probably not models, but very attractive) in my med school class are engaged or married to "cute" girls.  The kind of girls who you'd meet and say, "yeah, she's pretty" but who wouldn't cause you to do a double take.  

So, hot future male neurosurgeon and cute marketer for Pepsi?

Men can value stability also.

www.ugly.org/.../men_1.html

I was nodding along with your general premise until I reached the Daily Throb and found myself repelled by the tragic specter of this harridan Monica Ivankan.  Please tell me this is an example of the sort that requires an unattractive man to make her tolerable in comparison.  If you direct your gaze six inches away from her boobies, you will see that this is the head of a recession-era real-estate agent.  

Well, I know a number of cute, but not model-material men who've dated female models.  Men and women alike try to casually bring this up to impress you, I think...  Not necessarily to threaten you, maybe more like just to impress you with their own worth.

And you seem to be attracted to women who look a certain way, a lot of the time -have you ever thought that someone might look at you and a gf and think that you were the shlubby guy with the hot gf?

For me, looks matter a lot to me in what turns me on, for my sister it's personality and she genuinly enjoys being the better looking one in the couple.  So I'm not one for generalities.  Also, it really DOES depend on what you consider modeling.  People can model regularly even, and yet still some types are more competitive than others.

I tell you -you think dating women who mention they've dated male models is bad, try dating a guy who you're starting to like, who then breaks it off w/ you cuz he's not over his ex, who happens to be a very conventionally-attractive erotica model built nothing like you, who you can find nudie pics of w/ the wonders of google...  'Course, he claimed looks don't matter to him much.

see, these critical comments (*dval* *cough*) would be why I'd never show my pics round this crowd...

Oh for pity's sake, Toluca! I might critique a photo of a cheesecake chippie spilling out of her dress with desire to be the most spellbinding creature in the room, but hoards of male admirers and millions of dollars shore her up against my anonymous assessment on a pop culture sex blog she will never read.  On the other hand, you suggested a real person you are interacting with, Mr. Z, might be considered "shlubby".  That's downright mean!  Pictured with his girlfriend, the two are cute and nicely matched.

I bet you are also plenty attractive and would have a fair share of admirers if your sensitivity was exerted externally rather than turned against yourself. You write "looks matter a lot to me in what turns me on."  Perhaps this is why you are assuming the same of others.  One of my best friends is overweight and has always dated fun, great-looking men.  She once scolded another whining acquaintance by saying, "I may be fat, but it's never stopped me from fucking who I wanted to fuck and dating who I wanted to date.  You must have other issues."  

As I recall, you described yourself as tall and skinny (the preferred & promoted body type of all Westernized nations).  Wring out your sob rag and start shakin' that bony ass!      

I don't think I have a sob rag, just making the point that plenty of us are less conventionally attractive than the celebrities being criticized -and if you'd look at a celebrity w/ such a negative first reaction, I don't think it's a stretch to think you'd look at other people similarly.  Celebrities ARE "real people" -just famous ones.  I've known some myself.  And I disagree that thinness is the "preferred & promoted body type of all Westernized nations".  At least in the U.S., I think it would more accurately be described as T&A with a small waist...

And I don't know what your friend looked like, but in my observations, overweight women with pretty, girlish faces tend to do pretty much fine in dating...

askmeanything:

Wait til the hot male med students in your class finish residency. Miss Stable/Average/Cutie will be quickly 86d for Miss Victoria's/Secret/Model.

Yup.

My T&A with tiny waist has emerged in my thirties and the only benefits have been a new-found audience in the Hispanic and African American population manifesting in truckloads of men shouting affirmations such as "TaDOW!" and "Back that shit UP!" as I walk the dog.  

In college I was of the skinny and lanky variety where my knees appeared larger than my calves and I was once compared to Shelly Duval!  Still, I managed to corral my fair share of gentlemen through kittenish behavior, kindness, and a dash of smarts.  Toluca, you seem sharp and aware of the world, but maybe young and unsure.    Unconventional good looks are where it's at!  In France they call the phenomenon Jolie-lad (sp?) and it speaks of a strange pretty/ugly sexiness that is way hotter than conventional symmetrical beauty.  I know a scrawny woman who slouches and sucks in her cheeks to appear more shrunken.  Men find her fragile and are always fetching drinks and carrying things for her.  She makes the wimpiest guy feel like a He-man.  HARNESS YOUR POWER!!!

Well, I'm not delicate boned.  I don't think I could appear fragile if I wanted to.  

But I agree with your point that you might as well embrace what you got.  Doesn't mean that looking like a Victoria's Secret Model (or Scarlett Johansson, or whatever, or just plain more stereotypically "young, feminine, cute girl") wouldn't make a difference in the way a lot of guys reacted to me.  I am early 20s, after all.

Also dval,

Not sure how true this is, but through talks with my momma I've come to a hunch that there may be something of a generational difference at play here.  It seems to me older men are more likely to like elegant thin types, whereas boys my age grew up with J. Lo, Angelina Jolie, hip-hop culture, and anorexia-prevention videos in school that claimed "real women have curves".

Toluca, I knew I felt maternal towards you!  When I was really young I took on the care and feeding of a 7yr. old girl abandoned by her mother (illegal punk rock adoptions ruled back then).  She is now 20 and 6 ft. 2 inches tall, sturdy boned, with a size 11 shoe.  She is an art scholar, but constantly asked "Do you play basketball?"  (I tell her to inquire if questioners are jockeys or miniature golf champions).  The thing is, she finds dating difficult because she feels everyone wants a petite girl and there are so few big burly men at her progressive college. The biggest problem she has discovered is that "hook-up" culture has little to do with looks and a lot to do with noncommittal guys hopping from girl to girl.  The best thing you can do is value yourself as a rare, amazing, one-of-a-kind girl who deserves nothing short of absolute adoration.  If you earn it through your actions, intellect, and charm, you'll develop your inner curves (interior complexity).  

Lame mom-like post-script:  I encouraged my sorta-daughter to engage in sports/physical activities.  She became a noncompetitive regular runner and feels that body strength and agility have replaced her former size/stature discomfort.  She has even gotten over her anxiety of dating short guys and settled on the notion that hilarious smart people are always hot!  I bet there are guys out there who have already figured out that you are wicked cute, so when YOU discover it there will be plenty to pick from!